Ep 32 - Thoughts, Lies, And The Roles They Play

0:07 Welcome back to the Head, Heart & Boots podcast. I'm Chris. And I'm Brandon. Join us as we wrestle with what it takes to transform ourselves and the businesses we lead. I don't know. What'd you think? I don't know. It was kind of serious. Should we laugh? Amigo, how are you? I'm good, man. What a whirlwind week. What day is it? I don't even want to go there. I honestly feel like we're just constantly on a roller coaster. We've talked about that before. It's like the ups and downs of standard week are just wild. Downs being like those peaks of stress and the what the heck factor.

0:48 Anyways, it's fun. It's fun. It's stressful. It's fun. You know what's funny about this topic that we were batting around is I'm pulling up my ideas, my little notebook of ideas. Oh, yeah. The black book, if you will. Yeah, yeah. It's Apple Notes. It's really called Ideas. And I have this longish note that relates back to this that I wrote like three or four days ago after a conversation with my wife. Anyway, so there's a lot of meat here. This has been occupying a lot of headspace. I made this comment before we got on of how I see myself assigning reality to my thoughts. And you're like, oh, dude, I know what you're talking about. This idea that thoughts come into my head without me even choosing them.

1:33 It's the thing about thoughts is our mind is constantly generating them. And it was Eckhart Tolle. So Eckhart Tolle wrote A New Earth and he wrote The Power of Now. Fantastic books. A little woo-woo. You got to get through the new age language. I think it's uncomfortable for some people. But the core premise is really built around our ego and what our ego does and how our ego generates these thoughts. Our minds have just evolved to where if you pause, if you just hit pause and sit quietly, within a few seconds, your mind starts getting flooded with thoughts. Yeah. Some of them are stressful thoughts. And some of them are just wacky, repetitive thoughts about nonsense.

2:14 But our tendency is to accept these thoughts as true. And I've just been realizing how quickly I get sucked into, particularly with marriage and with children right now at this stage of life. But when I think about it, I realize, wow, that is sort of a regular... It creates routine suffering for me. Yeah, right. So first off, just the term routine suffering. Yeah. Sounds horrible. Yeah, we all exist. But people know what I mean, right? So anyway, here's the note that I put in here. And now I had story about Kara and marriage. Kara's my wife, but I don't remember what the story was, the context for this. It doesn't matter though.

2:54 I said, it's okay to feel the emotion, the pain, the anger. Just don't make plans at the same time. That's really great advice. Right? Yeah. And listen, I'm going to be really transparent here about marriage. My wife and I have been married 20 years. 20 years next month. Which is... I mean, March. Yeah. It's huge. 20 years. March 22nd. I remembered it. I'm ready. I still have time to figure out something special. I think... I could be alone in this, but I think anybody who's been married more than a minute had serious thoughts about divorce. Sure. Yeah. Or just the... I mean, isn't that fair? The complexities. Yeah. We don't like to talk about that out loud. I mean, especially because you and I come from a pretty spiritual, religious background.

3:37 It's like divorce is not ideal or frowned upon, whatever. Yeah. But the reality that we live inside our head is you contend with that. I don't care how much you liked your spouse when you got married, how much you love them now. It's like you... Divorces... You get these thoughts coming out of a conversation with your spouse that just set you off. And these thoughts are revolving around your head and you start spinning out. You go down this dark path. Yeah. You can find yourself starting to make action plans. Like, boy, if this doesn't change or this doesn't get better, I don't know if I want that. And then what next? And what next? And you start spinning out on these things. Yeah. Yeah. And if you're not careful, right, it can really mess things up. It starts to affect your behavior towards that person.

4:19 You pull back emotionally. And anyway, so I think anybody who's been married more than a minute, they understand what that's about. Yeah. Now they wouldn't necessarily ever say out loud, I'm thinking about getting divorced, but these are the thoughts. Right. Right. And so I wrote this note. I was coming out of one of those experiences with my wife where we were just really at loggerheads, just really frustrated with each other. And as I was coming out of that, I realized, wow, I'm so glad I didn't stay in that place. Because then we were able to have a conversation and process through that stuff. And those thoughts left me. Yeah. And inevitably, it wasn't what you thought. I recognize in me, I have a very high capacity for emotion.

5:01 I run hot. I'm a fiery spirit. These thoughts come to me. I start to get wrapped up in it. It's the same energy that causes me to be successful in business. I think there's this fiery spirit. When I'm in something, I'm in it. And I can very easily get in it with these thoughts. Well, it's even that orientation towards action. Oh yeah. I think an old school half joke, half truth is this idea that with our partners, when they share maybe the strains or stresses or the experiences that they're having, our initial reaction is to fix it. We want to go in and start answering the problem, overcoming the problem. And I think the same thing happens.

5:42 We just tend to be oriented towards action. And so it's like, if you assign truth to these experiences or the thoughts in your mind, then we start heading down certain path of execution or of action. And inevitably with that, we could be spending an enormous amount of time and energy... overcoming or fighting an obstacle that wasn't even a real obstacle. We can take all this action in the wrong direction because we just started assigning this truth to just thoughts or emotions, like those things that fire up in an instant. Dude, when you said that this morning, I was like, oh my gosh, that is... It is similar to the assigning your identity to certain things.

6:25 It's the same idea almost where we make something fact when it isn't yet, perhaps. It's just a thing that we're wrestling with. I hate even sometimes opening the pathways to some of these thoughts because then it makes me reevaluate past experiences and some of them being pretty critical to the overall trajectory my life's been on. I'm just thinking back to a certain relationship. I'm thinking back to certain professional environments where it's like, I know if I'm honest with myself, that me assigning truth to a thought or an emotion or a perspective most certainly influenced me. It caused you to take action that you know wasn't the best course of actions.

7:10 Yeah. Or in cases where it's just in question. Yeah. I don't know. Yeah. And I'm not saying I would hit rewind or I'd do it differently. But I think that there is some power in stopping and thinking about that, that, man, I may have taken a course of action that was... Yeah. Not necessarily built on real truth. Yeah. Right. And so I wrote some more. I wrote, so it's okay to feel the emotion, the pain, the anger, the whatever, just don't make plans. Just let yourself feel the things. Like I can feel upset and angry. I can feel frustrated with this aspect of my marriage or this conversation with my kids or whatever the thing is, or you did downline employees. Like this is transferable to every relationship we have.

7:51 Right. Yeah. And even ourselves, because we can get in some really negative thought cycles about our own selves, performance, who am I, who am I not, all these things. And then I said, we get some pretty wild and crazy stories whipped up in our minds in no time flat. We judge why the person said this or that or did this or that and instantly know what they meant. by what they said, what their intention was of why they did this or that. Yeah. Right. Which then drives us to the question of what do I need to do because of that action that was taken or that thing that they said, what do I need to do? And we just start making plans of how we're going to respond to that person, what we need to do, what boundaries we got to set, what discipline maybe is called for in that situation.

8:37 Right. All of this happened in the course of... It started in the course of 60 seconds. Right. We're reacting to a thing and then these stories just start forming. And instead, I wrote, what would happen if we just paused and felt the emotion we were having and then consider the rest later? Let it pass almost for a moment. Yeah. I was asking myself, do I feel like sometimes I'm a bit rash with my initial responses? And I answer myself, I know I am. So I'm just processing through this. And this again, when I wrote this, I'm coming out of a difficult conversation with my wife. And I'm realizing all these things, but man, I just know this is a cycle. It's a cycle for me.

9:17 I'm becoming more aware of it. But I think, you know what I'm doing in that moment is, I don't think there's any other way to say this. But when I assign reality to my thoughts like that and I start spinning out, the other thing that's going on is the only person I can really see in the equation is me. Yeah. If I'm really honest with myself, when I'm going off on these thoughts, I'm lost in my head. Yeah. I can only see me in that moment and how this is affecting me and how is this going to hurt me or thwart my goals or plans or desires or whatever. Yeah. And again, it doesn't matter if it's a marriage context or a work or business or anything else.

9:58 It's like when I get lost in those thoughts, I'm captive inside myself. And I can't see others as people that have their own thoughts that are screwing with their head. I can be so quick to judge why my wife said this or didn't say this or did that or didn't do this. And in that moment, I'm so lost in how that affects me. I can't even see her. Yeah, right. As like, she may have her own shit that's going through her head. Right. Messing with her response and her attitude towards me. Yeah. It's impossible for me to value that though, because I'm so lost in what this means. Right. You know what I mean? Yeah. No, it's funny that you say that. A conversation I was having, actually with my kids not that long ago, I have adult kids, my 21 and 20...

10:44 And we were just talking about maturity and what signs of maturity were and are. And we were just having this conversation back and forth around the idea that at relatively wide range of ages, we might have some bills. We might have some costs that we're responsible for. We may have these things that we're doing that mimic or look like stuff that only adults do. But just because we began to do those things, it doesn't mean that we're maturing. And so what we talked about is we were trying to create some definition around what does maturity actually look like? Hang with me. It's going to come back. And this idea was maturity is almost a measurement of when we begin to view our interaction with the rest of the world for the sake of the other person.

11:33 And maybe let me just unpack that idea a little bit. Often, and it's really easy to see in our kids, right? Even though we're doing it, but it's easy for me as a third party to view this in my kids, where my kids are very good at seeing themselves in the world. But it's always, or it tends to be from the perspective of me acting this way affects this room. How does that affect me? Not how does it affect the other person for the sake of the other person. And so we were just trying to come to an agreement on maturity is those people that you see their awareness, how they behave, how they interact with their sphere of influence is consistently from the perspective of how is this impacting that person, right?

12:16 So anyways, what you're talking about is actually a layer on that. It's this idea that it almost makes us turn back to adolescence problem solving when we can only see the situation from the perspective of my perspective and how it affects me. Right? So we go backwards in our maturity if we agree on the definition. Yeah. When we get caught up in assigning that truth that way. Yeah. it literally makes us regress in our ability to have relationship. It's interesting, right? This goes back and we've talked about this before, but I think it's so timeless and it's so helpful for me. The Arbinger Institute, the leadership and self-deception thing of being in the box.

12:58 Yeah, yeah. Right, where they talk about when we're in the box, we're consumed with me. Now, in the moment, we don't ever see it that way because our ego doesn't like to take on that we're being selfish or anything like that, right? When we're in the box, it's like we see everybody else as an object to overcome, a thing to push aside to get where we're going, a vehicle by which we can get to what we want. And when we step out of the box, we see other people as humans who are having the same kinds of thoughts we are. Yeah. Yeah. And I think this is one of the areas where I've really struggled at times in my career with leadership because I think as leaders, we already tend to be very achievement-focused and objective-focused.

13:42 It's easy to get lost in that. Oh, yeah. And to get off on these tangents in our head about an employee, about a business partner, even about a client or a would-be client. just to spin out and stop seeing others as people that have similar hopes, dreams, fears, and anxieties like us. And instead just see them as a box we need to check or an obstacle we need to overcome. And boy, things go downhill real fast when we get in that mode. Yeah. And I think oftentimes we don't even realize we get in that mode because I think it's so normative. All of us have these stories in our head. Right? Yeah. Yeah, I wrote down as we were talking. I said, I assign reality to my thoughts and it Fs me up every time. That's almost every time.

14:23 Yeah, right? As opposed to questioning our thoughts, which is what Eckhart Tolle would say. And again, I realized this is the Head, Heart & Boots podcast. We're in the construction industry. We're in the nuts and bolts. We're in a concrete business. We do things. We're very practical. And so sometimes this stuff feels really like navel gazing, kind of woo-woo. Like we're just... But I think the older I get, the more I realize it's these head games that make the difference between people that are really building something they're proud of. They're happy in the process. Yeah. Like the happiness is not something out there in front of them, but they're able to sort of... they're happy now. Yeah. It has to do with these head games. Yeah. Yeah.

15:03 There's just their ability to adapt and overcome. You and I were talking this morning a little bit about, I just got done listening to one of, I'm going to murder his last name, Tim Bilyeu. Oh, Bilyeu. Yeah. The guy who founded Quest Protein Bars. Yeah. Sold it for like 2 billion bucks. Oh yeah. Big money. And then he's gone on to be a real key influencer. Anyways, his guest was Tony Robbins. And, Tony Robbins is one of those names, I think, in the self-leadership, self-growth type environment. He's the guy, probably on mass. He was talking about just ungodly numbers of people participating in online webinars. We're talking about almost a million people participating.

15:45 He's got to reach out to Zoom founders and leadership and have them modify their system to meet his need of this particular program he's putting on. crazy. But what just struck me is, Tony is very diligent about the way that he... This is probably oversimplification. But the way he serves is his goal is to change your perspective. His work that he does is he wants you to realize that a lot of the things that you've been telling yourself or that you've bought into about your perspective on yourself, your skills, your capabilities, they're just what you're talking about. We've assigned truth to a thought. That's all the more it was. Yeah. And then you watch that live out in our lives.

16:27 And so one of the things that struck me is that I was listening to these obstacles, ungodly obstacles that he overcame. Elon Musk is another person that he's done more for space science than... in a 10 years than we have since the 60s, right? And it's because he's like this. He's not limited by assigning truth, I think sometimes to these thoughts or feelings, right? Yeah. Anyways, one of the things that just struck me personally is, how does this affect me as a business owner? How does this affect me and the level of effort that I give our business, the sales, the growth, the different mechanisms to keep it healthy? And I realized how short I've sold myself because of assigning truth to a thought.

17:13 Yeah. Right? So here's a pretty simple example. How many of us have a business that's virtually looked about the same for the last two to three years? Same problems, same frustrations. Maybe their color's a little bit different, but really at the end of the day, it's the same shit, different day. Yeah. Right? Where's that saying come from? And what I've realized is how often that is a byproduct of a business owner that is assigned truth to a thought, to a limitation, and they've bought it. And it may be the farthest thing from the truth. Half of what you and I do is just redirecting people's thoughts on what is possible. Yeah. And I just literally, going through my mind, the Rolodex of people in our sphere of influence, people where they've had great successes And then there's the same challenge that just sticks around.

17:59 They can't overcome it. And I realized how much of that is probably just in their mind. And it's like, how do you communicate to someone that the thing that they've accepted or the level at which they've stopped pushing their business or whatever the case may be, it's like, man, if you could just hear a voice that told you that's completely bullshit, it's not even real. Yeah. than would happen throughout the next 12 months if they got freed from that. And dude, I've got names in my mind right now to include my own. Oh, yeah. Right? Where I'm like, dude, what if this year, right? All right, let's take a minute to recognize and thank our MitResto Mastery sponsor, Accelerate Restoration Software.

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21:01 Yeah, three of the kind of big things that stuck out to me when being introduced to AI and their team. First off is this consistently updated training. I mean, at the end of the day, these guys are the experts. They're out front all the time. They're constantly learning new trade secrets and ensuring that your team's got access to those things. A 3,700 plus page database of Xactimate templates. I don't know what else to say here other than don't reinvent the wheel. It's already available. Download it, copy it, use it, bam. database of commonly missed items. I think this is huge. So many of us can change the numbers by just moving the needle a couple points and those commonly missed items can make all the difference in the world.

21:44 So go check them out at value.getinsights.org backslash fcg. So my wife introduced me to this author probably three years ago, Byron Katie. Oh, yeah. And I've talked about her before. Yeah. So Byron Katie wrote this book called Loving What Is. She's a very fascinating figure. And her story is very interesting, a little bit weird, very interesting. And also just common to all of us. We're talking about this story in our head. that we form, she developed this response to that called inquiry, is what she's called it. Doing the work is what she says. And so what she advocates for in her book and her coaching practice is to essentially question the thoughts that come into our head.

22:31 And she has these four questions. I don't know if I've ever talked about this in a podcast or not. And I don't even know that I'm going to remember all the questions. But there's a couple that really stick out to me that I found useful. But the first thing that she asks... her counseling recipients, this is kind of her mode of counseling, is they will share that stressful or negative thought that's been rolling around in their head about a person, about a situation, a relationship, whatever. And the very first question of inquiry is, is it true? Is this thought actually true? And then of course, when we're in the heat of the moment, it feels incredibly true. And that's why we think it's real. And so she follows it with a Because a lot of times when we have a stressful or negative thought come in about an employee, a business partner, a spouse, a boyfriend, girlfriend, a kid, or whatever, or just our general circumstances, we make a lot of assumptions to support that it's true.

23:26 Right. And so when you ask that second question of, can I absolutely know that this thing I am thinking about this personal situation is true, and that starts to break down the thought. Yeah. And it's like, well... well, no, there's no way for me to get inside their head and know that's what they were thinking or motivated by. And it starts to break down almost immediately for me. And so I've started to get in the habit of that, is just asking, I start to feel frustrated and feel this thought that I've been mulling over in my head and feeling negative about it. And if I pause long enough... and say, you know what? Is this actually true? Did Brandon really mean to say it to me that way? Was he saying it because of X, Y, and Z? Is that why he made that comment that I'm really frustrated about or whatever?

24:09 And the moment I ask myself that question, it starts to break down. And it's like, you know what? No. Brandon and I, we've worked together a long time. I don't think that was his primary motivator. I'm still uncomfortable with this thought I'm having, but then it starts to break down. It starts to loosen up. And I'm like... No. I know he didn't mean to do that, right? Or say that. Or he didn't mean it that way. And then after a while, it just dissipates. You know what that reminds me of? You know when you get a freaking knot? Think about a shoelace knot. It's like your first instinct is pull and pick at it. And then it just gets worse and worse. But then when you just kind of slow down.

24:49 You just kind of push it back towards each other. You work it right. It gets loose and then you can untie it. I'm almost envisioning what you're talking about happening as your mind just pauses for a second and says, is it true? Yeah, it's so good. And okay. So, and then there's this other question in the inquiry. So if that doesn't work, usually that's enough for me. She actually has these worksheets that she... You can print them out for free on her website. They're called judge your neighbor worksheets. Oh, geez. Which is really funny. It sounds really weird. But literally, she encourages you to write down, judge your neighbor, the person that you're having these negative, stressful thoughts. Write down verbatim what the thought is in your head. My spouse is a terrible spouse. They do such a poor job of taking care of me.

25:31 Just write down what the literal thoughts are that are coming in your mind and plaguing you with. Or this employee, they're so irresponsible. They don't take whatever. Whatever the thing is. And even just the act of sometimes saying the thought out loud... Because you're subconsciously processing this shit most of the time, right? It's just like these thoughts are tumbling around in your head in the midst of all the other stuff you're doing in the day, right? So I'm not saying that all of us consciously think about these things obsessively, but I think everybody knows what I'm talking about, right? Yeah. And when you just pause a moment, you say, wow, part of me is just really wrapped around the axle on this situation or this person, this conversation. Just the act of noticing it starts to make it dissipate.

26:11 But if that doesn't work, she has another question. And she says, right now, who would I be in this moment without that thought? Like if I wasn't thinking this thing about my spouse or my employee or my business partner or my peer, who would I be in this moment if I wasn't thinking that thought? That's a really powerful consideration. Yeah. Because I have all these negative emotions, anger, frustration, or potentially embarrassment or shame or whatever it is that I'm contending with. Yeah. Who would I be if I didn't have those things going on inside me? Well, I'd be calm. I'd be collected. I'd be more discerning.

26:53 I'd probably have better critical thinking. I would be less stressed. I would feel more accepting or loving toward that person. Right? All these things. So it's an interesting mental exercise. All of this point... So I was listening to another... I know this is kind of a circuitous path here that we're taking. But What path are we taking? Okay. All right. Circuitous. Wow. Great job, Mr. Scrabble. You know what? I'm just going to own this. I was always one of the best spellers growing up. I had a good vocabulary. I guess I'd read a lot when I was a kid. Yeah. Well played on that one. Anyway. All right. Whatever. So... We're taking the circuitous path. I think it's the first time for me.

27:33 I don't know. I'm glad you like that. I have said it for you. Really resonates with me. I'm sorry. Go ahead. We all have different roles. So I'm listening to this Knowledge Project podcast and he had Mark Andreessen. So Mark Andreessen is... I think he's a managing partner of Andreessen Horowitz, which is one of the most successful, prolific venture capital firms in Silicon Valley of all time. They have an office in New York and they have an office... Blah, blah, blah. Ben Horowitz is a partner, also very fascinating. Yeah. But I'm listening to Mark Andreessen talk. And this is a guy who's... I mean, he was an investor in Google. They were an investor in all of the big brands that we see today over the last 20 years.

28:17 Andreessen Horowitz has probably had an investment round in. When I listen to how this guy talks... there's a thoughtful, kind of dispassionate tone to his voice where he's able to really... When you hear him talk, even about political matters and just the current events of the day and the things that are affecting his businesses and his investments and what's happening in the business world... you can just tell he doesn't identify with the challenges or anything. He's able to just look really clearly. And it's almost like he can argue both sides of a thing. Like Lex Friedman's another podcast that I really love to listen to. And these guys are so like, they're so nerdy and they're so smart, you know?

29:01 But he talks about being able to steel man any argument. Like to be able to look at both sides and argue for both sides of a situation. And I see that in a lot of leaders I admire. They really... It's valuable to them to be able to really look at both sides of a situation with understanding. Yeah. Yeah. And I see that in a lot of the leaders I admire where they're just, they're dispassionate in that way. It doesn't mean they're not passionate about things. Yeah. But when it comes to conflict or problems or challenges, they're able to really dispassionately step back, get out of their head and look at both sides. Start thinking. Honestly. Yeah. Yeah. Just honestly say, okay, what's happening here? Yeah.

29:41 What are people feeling on both sides of this? What's impacting this interaction, this relationship? move forward. And I'm like, man, I want to be more of that. There's something very attractive to me when I listen to a guy like Marc Andreessen and frankly, Shane Parrish, who runs that. It's one of the things I'm attracted with him is he's dispassionate in the way of he's always a learner. Yeah, sure. Well, and I think what you're hitting on is there's an opportunity for us to experience a really limited tool set for problem solving when we're just subconsciously being led through that, right? Like what you're talking about. So I mean, I'm even thinking about what are some of the thoughts that we're all having right now that we've collectively assigned truth to?

30:27 This might rub some the wrong way, but let's think about recruitment. How many of us right now are repeating the same exact phrase verbatim that everyone else is saying? To include us. I'm not separating myself from this group. Sure. We're all using the same language and we've assigned truth to it. Yet, we've seen and had conversations with people that do not agree with what we're saying. We know businesses right now that recruitment is not even a problem on their radar today. Yeah. Now, are we saying that collectively nothing's changed about the recruiting and hiring environment? Absolutely not. But see, here's the difference with this.

31:07 And I'm just trying to even use some of our own experiences with this. If I assign truth to my first thought, my gut reaction to hiring right now for key staff at the tech level, I'm buying the same message. And the message is you can't find good people right now. Yeah. Okay. Well, I'm just going to stop trying. People don't like to work hard anymore. Yeah. People don't like to work hard anymore. No one wants to do anything within the trades. I've said all this. I've said all of it within the last 48 hours. Nobody's coming into the trades anymore. We have this big problem. We have this big problem. Yeah. Now... Are there elements of that story that are factual? Yes, for the most part. But look what happens to our problem-solving capacity.

31:48 And most of this is probably happening on a subconscious level. As soon as I make the statement or assign truth to that thought, it's impossible to hire people right now. Then what effort are you and your brain putting forth to solve the fucking problem? Yeah. None. Yeah. None. Well, and even worse, we talked about when you're feeling these things, because they're real feelings, right? We get nervous about it because it is harder than it used to be, blah, blah, blah. When we're in that, we start to make plans. Yeah, there we go. We make the wrong plans. We make the wrong plan, right? And some of those plans look like kind of giving up. Whereas I'm watching, I mean, going back to that Tony Robbins comment, like one of the things that was blowing me away by what he was talking about were these unbelievable obstacles that they had to overcome.

32:34 Well, if he assigned truth to every thought that he had, it would have been impossible. Or something would have taken nine months. Instead, they turned it out nine weeks. What people can accomplish... And this is going back to what you're talking about with key leaders. Most of the time, these leaders have changed the environments that they're operating in because they don't assign truth to a thought and they let that truth breathe or they let that thought breathe a little bit. And they ask questions. They don't attach their identity to it. Next thing you know, when you look at the toolkit that they have available to solve problems, it's huge. Whereas you've already limited to either one choice or no choice by us assigning this cold truth to a thought.

33:17 It's very interesting. It's very interesting. And look at our ancestors. There are always, no matter the circumstances, world wars, famines, disease... there's still winners. Yeah. There's still people that figure it out. Yeah. You think about how Rockefeller built all of his wealth, right? Yeah. In the crash, he made different choices. He responded differently to the situation. Yeah. And of course, there's always advantages that the winners have, but usually there was a different mindset, a different response. Yeah. Right. It was choosing to look at the circumstances differently. Yeah. that allowed them to derive different outcomes.

33:59 Right. When everybody else was languishing in the reality they chose to... And now it's just not like a... Again, this isn't a woo-woo deal where it's like manifesting. You know, it's like, we're just going to say what we want Right. And if we just say it enough, we're going to create this different reality. Right. And I don't even say that maybe some of that psychology is wrong, but that's not really what we're talking about. I think what we're really talking about is just taking a moment, creating some distance between these stressful negative thoughts we have, and just giving a little bit of pause to consider them, oftentimes is enough to gain perspective and to see the other thoughts. option.

34:39 It's like, okay, who would I be in this moment without this thought? Well, I wouldn't be stressed out. Okay, well then what's the value of me being stressed out about this? And you start to break down the thought and you're like, okay, all right. There's probably some other things I can do here. I have maybe more control than I'm letting on. I have more agency in this situation than... than I was previously thinking. I was in more of a victim state of this, things are happening to me. These employees are doing this thing to my business. These business partners are treating me in a way that I don't like. And you move away from those thoughts and you're like, okay, Right. I have control of myself. What do I have control over and what actions, what options do I actually have?

35:21 And you discover I've got other options of how I'm going to respond to this. Yeah, I love it. I think in a lot of ways, it's funny, like some of these conversation topics are themes and the themes tend to kind of interconnect with one another. I remember years and years ago, we really kind of started adopting the use of and training with this QBQ, ask the right question, taking ownership. And what was really interesting about that is just this, I think it's very similar in lines of the things that we're talking about right now, where it's just this idea of keeping more options available to you in your choice making when you approach something from the right perspective, from the right direction. And how as soon as we buy into these very limiting thoughts, and again, like you said, there is truth in these.

36:07 There are facts that you're dealing with. It's just not allowing those facts to overlay the whole conversation or the whole obstacle. And a big part of that whole QBQ and taking ownership for yourself is approaching things from that perspective of, I can talk about the facts of the situation, but I'm going to stay away from this limiting victim mentality that removes my choice-making capacity, that removes my ability to address the problem, to affect change in it. Because as soon as we show up already defeated, and I'm not saying this is the only thoughts that people have, but honestly, the downside is predominantly driven by these limiting thoughts. That's the same idea, though.

36:48 If you take all the tools out of the toolkit, then what are you left with? with no options. Right. But yeah, you're left with anger, command control. Right. Right. Like domineering. I mean, it's like we have other tools in the tool set. It's just that there's a whole different set of consequences, right. That those things bring. Yeah. No, that's a good one, man. It's an interesting topic. It's funny too, because I think these are the kinds of discussions that I know for me, I need to hear this stuff over and over and over. Yeah. Because it's like we have this... We were talking about these patterns that happen. It's like we'll have a thought or an exchange or have an interaction with somebody that brings up some point or key topic or whatever. And then it feels like for the next 2, 3, 4 days, there's just all this repeating content that comes at you or that you experience.

37:34 God knows that might be Google-driven. Anyways... But what I like about that is that this is one of those things where it spurs change in me. Hearing that Tony Robbins thing made me just us relook at our business. What are we going to tackle this year? What limiting thoughts have we adopted? What truths have we assigned to some of the things that we've considered? And how is that slowing us down and or speeding us up? And there's this burst of energy I get of, Okay, F that. Like, okay, I'm going to retract some of these truths that I've assigned to it. I'm going to think about it openly. You and I are going to have a dialogue. Right. And all of a sudden, we're going to realize there's these new tools in our toolkit to solve problems with and how exciting that is.

38:14 But I also know inevitably 90 days, 120 days, I'm going to be back in that zone a little bit. Yeah. Right. And then I'm going to need that reawakening again to get the fuel back. Yeah. Yeah, it is like a, it's a discipline. It is. It's disciplining our mind. Yeah. I think, well, I see it. I see, you know, and who knows? I don't know Mark Andreessen outside of this. I don't know Shane Parrish. We don't know Elon and stuff like what their personal lives look like. But it seems that there's a pattern that you can get to a place where you've developed that discipline enough to where that's your default response. Yeah. I think that's what, you know, that's what I want. I want it to be more of my instinct to question my thoughts.

38:54 Yep. And I'm not quite there. I'm not there. Yeah. Yeah. Same. But I'm becoming more aware and it feels good. I just feel like I'm in a healthier season of life as I'm starting to think of this stuff and notice it more quickly. Yeah. Yeah. versus it languishing and spinning out on some of these negative thoughts or themes or stories in my head, I'm able to snap out of it a little sooner when I'm in that discipline. Yep. I agree with that. And same thing I've noticed with my wife and I. It's been really great because whereas something used to percolate negatively in our relationship for a week, we get in these week-long cycles, and then we have a good talk, and then we get through it, and then we dip back in that cycle...

39:34 it's with both my wife and I adopting more of this discipline. Now it's down to like, we'll have a bad day or maybe a couple of days and then we'll get through it and we'll talk through it. We'll clear the table of these thoughts that we've both been having. Right. So it happens faster and it's like, okay, there's more health there. You know? Well, and I think a big part of this, and it's probably true for a lot of the things that you and I chat about or wrestle with is, is that so much of... So first off, it's kind of like you have to be comfortable with the fact that even as we're developing and growing as individuals, there's going to be these cycles. There's going to be times where we just kind of slip back into old patterns or it's like that discipline weans for whatever reason.

40:17 And this is why I think it's so critical for us to be better at surrounding ourselves with the right kind of sphere. Is because there's going to be... It's kind of like... my wife and I are rarely firing on all cylinders at the same time. Right? Like there's normally, it's like, if I'm having a rough week, thankfully, a lot of times my wife has really got some stuff handled. Yeah. And maybe vice versa. Business-wise, you and I have talked about this very openly before. It's not very often, I would say, that you and I both are like, just all cylinders are fired up and we are just grinding away. Yeah. There's this give and take where it's like because of scenarios, family life, the things like you might be down a cylinder or two, but I'm strong that week and vice versa.

41:01 And there's something really powerful about that sense of community. And I think by us saying, hey, it's inevitable as we try to work through some of these things, add new tools to the toolkit. we're going to be having moments of slipping or a cylinder not firing. And then what does it look like for me to have friends, business partners, peers that are conscious of this stuff, that are thinking about it, that are trying to engineer their life a little bit more appropriately? And then can they be there for me and vice versa? Yeah. When inevitably I slip back in, somebody just to wake you up and say like, bro, stop being a victim. Pull your head out of your ass. Yeah. It's like, okay, yeah, I needed that. All right, here we go again. Right? Yeah.

41:41 So I think we all have these negative and stressful thoughts. And I think what we're suggesting from our own experience is it's worth taking an inventory of that and saying, okay, is this something that happens for me too? I'm pretty sure it does. So we have these universal negative and stressful thoughts. They feel very real, whether it's our marriage or our business or anything else. And we talked about the value, like Byron Katie questioning those thoughts. I think that's the habit. That's the discipline is saying, wow, part of me is really spinning out on that situation, that conversation I had with my employee or with my spouse or my business partner or whatever. What's that about? And to just pause and take a look at that story in our head that's spinning around.

42:24 Considering like Byron Katie suggests... Who would I be in this moment? What kind of business owner, what kind of leader, manager, mentor, husband, father, friend, golfer, whatever, if I didn't have this thought rattling around in my head? Who would I be? What would I be bringing to this moment if I wasn't spinning out on this thought? Mm-hmm. And then I guess the way we ended is just having some grace or just some patience with yourself because this is a discipline and it takes a while to cultivate a new discipline. And this is probably one of those life disciplines that we're never going to fully arrive because we're always going to have this ego that's tugging at our sleeve, that wants attention, wants self-pleasure, wants what we want.

43:06 But I think over time, it's possible for that to become more normal, to not be so reactive. Yeah. And to be more like Mark Andreessen, who's dispassionate and able to look clearly at both sides and then make decisions. I think all of us, I mean, certainly any business people, we all want to make better decisions, be more decisive and create more legacy with our leadership than toxic residue. So that's right. So there we go. Yeah, I love it, man. This probably top 10 in terms of leadership skillset would probably be this. This is a pillar thought pattern that's worth investing energy in. And in my experience over the last maybe five years, as you and I have been really pressing into this stuff, it creates the most happiness.

43:46 Yeah, I agree. Joy. The most joy and really does move the needle in terms of reducing stress. Yeah. Which I know that's a thing for all of us. Oh God. Yeah. All right, brother. Okay. Till next time. All right, everybody. Hey, thanks for joining us for another episode of Head, Heart & Boots. And if you're enjoying the show, but you love this episode, please hit follow. Formerly known as subscribe, write us a review, or share this episode with a friend. Share it on LinkedIn, share it via text, whatever. It all helps. Thanks for listening.